Okay, we are now recording I am monique lillard I am doing these oral history interviews for the University of Idaho library oral History project about the video rental store in Moscow Idaho.

i'm talking with someone who will state his own name and just a minute, so that we get everything perfect about how we say it, but I want to ask first have you signed the waiver release.

Yes, perfect good Thank you so would you stay for the recording your name and your age or birthday, whatever you'd prefer.

Martin McGreevy: yeah my name is Martin mccree and i'm 35 years.

Monique Lillard: Oh, my goodness.

How did that happen.

You don't look 35 anyway, so that second.

Okay, just interested in your impressions of the store how and when did you find out about the video rental store.

How did that all unfold.

Martin McGreevy: yeah when I was in.

elementary school.

My parents would take us for like a tree to go to get a movie to watch at night.

From like on special occasions like on Fridays, and we would go to power to us in time there was a local one and we wanted to support them.

And we would go and we as kids would all run around the store and pick like our movie that we wanted to watch so like it would be like, I want to watch Batman no, I want to watch fantasia or watch.

Land for time or home alone, and then we would kind of get to the registered, and they have to hash it out and figure out which.

we're going to get sometimes he would get a couple and watch over the weekend, but it was like a really magical thing time to kind of contemplate going to the store and getting to watch a film and then we watch it as a family like make popcorn and everything.

And I remember, specifically the power to us was the one had the best curation because there were a few others, I think there was one called like video land or something like that so started to where, if you leave is now.

But the staff and employees that how to use had like a very particular brand of curation that made it really fun with you have her kids section.

they'd have like their staff picks what kind of more arthouse films and things so it was always a fun experience as a family figure out what we're going to get yeah.

Monique Lillard: yeah and are your memories of.

Which store or you remembering which actual physical.

Martin McGreevy: Building I remember what i'm remembering initially was the one that was near or where the yarn stores now for me it's like an insurance place.

Monique Lillard: Right right it's it's across from the Co op.

yeah yeah I you know you think I think it's well I don't know i'm not going to stay i'm not going to state things wrong for history here, which I think we know which one we're talking about.

It yes yeah.

Martin McGreevy: From the car.

Monique Lillard: Right, right now, how did the store change over the years in your memory.

Martin McGreevy: It became I remember, specifically, as I went through like junior high and high school, one thing that was really fun about it was.

The staff was kind of film buffs and they were kind of the cool I would say, you know the types that would move to Austin Texas or portland and they were like in high school or college and.

I remember admiring them they're really cool and some of them would be making films and different things on the side, and so, for me, watching this store it used to be, I think it could be wrong, but initially you know the owners of be there and then.

They ended up hiring.

Actually sort of self selecting to apply for a job, like that we're film buffs and like people who are really interested in film and filmmaking, and so the staff that I remember specifically kind of having a big impact on it were the Barber brothers and, if you remember them and.

They were really a cool group there's these two twin brothers.

Monique Lillard: I know for a fact one on one.

Martin McGreevy: affair and.

One of them, I think, ended up going to juilliard for music and the other one was in film and made us teacher.

At the can really hear one point but.

They were an inspiration.

To me, they were the.

Friends of one of my friends, they were like his older brothers friends and I remember their power to us was kind of this sanctuary for that type of.

Film obsessed and the file says music obsessed group, and it was kind of seen in Moscow and you go in and they were.

The ones you'd ask like what should you be watching and they would they would like make beer always really sweet like if you brought up.

cool film their eyes to the front counter they like this is awesome way to get to this one secrets and stuff so it felt like a kind of place where it's kind of creative on crowd with.

Monique Lillard: that's cool that's cool I i've written down the Barber twins because I would know their parents, so I can.

get in touch with them actually so.

What was your favorite section of the store.

Martin McGreevy: I love the.

European section, they would have most interesting kind of captivating imagery on their titles, so you go through, and I remember one time.

My friends and I were walking through and we rented this film called rat catcher by this film, including the ramsey who went on to do amazing and incredible films Scottish and.

That was her first feature, and as a super captivating images little boy on the cover it's like a close up on his face what I remember, and we were just kind of want to when we read today because it was so like avant garde and European on that had a huge impact on us.

Like having access to those kinds of Titles here mean in remote Moscow Idaho.

To have the foot of pre Internet era, the ability to go get films from the criterion collection and to get different.

curated sections for arthouse films from Germany, or it was just like what an amazing.

grouping of different types of cinema, and I think that was just a super lucky thing Moscow, especially I remember.

The micro movie house that like Dennis and Joe john West put on, and it was just sort of have a piece where their shows really basing our House.

European and world cinema, that would not be in the multiplex so Howard Hughes was one of those staples where you find all kinds of different things in films and videos it's time.

That you just couldn't create an error.

Monique Lillard: yeah yes, yes, and I even think they had a wall or a section that was films that were recently at the micro, I think that was one of the.

yeah least, at least in the in the store on Main Street so were you living in town and do you remember when it moved from the place across from co op down what about a.

Half a block over to Main Street.

Martin McGreevy: We do I do, I remember that transition and I loved what they did with the new space, because they really have that cool rack and it was a nice layout and I remember i'll go in there college and get like the office UK you.

ever seen you know.

And it was really during that transitional moment when.

You know some of the more obscure titles you wouldn't be able to find those to download on iTunes or something so it was still a great like resource for things in the pre streaming era find things and videos and different directors and.

Just to see.

I don't know the layout but they would put together there for.

episodic television in like England, they have a little section or didn't have like so TV.

You know, different parts of the world, and you just were like Sweden stuff in that kind of curation, if you like, was so great, and I also think that some.

Special in a pre stream era, and this is kind of going off topic, but that, nowadays, like all stand in front of the netflix screen for 25 minutes trying to figure out what to watch.

And then i'll go like you know, maybe there's maybe it's on netflix or HBO Max maybe maybe i'll watch something on YouTube or whatever.

The paralysis of choice kind of makes it so that you don't have watching anything where you go for the low hanging fruit, the obvious, and I feel like one of the great things that will be hard to describe to future generations, was having like an actual.

Like a.

Lack of choice meant that, like whatever you end up picking had a special place to it and you are much more likely to see it through, and not just skip.

ahead or turn it off after five minutes that you know it's not an either grabbing attention to something and I feel like for that as a lost art and power to us and video store being.

Having part of that be the act of going to the store picking up the video leaving with it and then putting it into your vcr DVD player watching it.

And then returning it maybe getting a late fee all of that, like in built into the process made you much more of a captive audience in a good way to finish and actually watch the fish.

Monique Lillard: really important point, I think you know lots been talked about how we're all losing our attention spans.

and being able to just click buttons and zoom zoom zoom.

zoom was not intended there to be mentioned, but you know it's related though you know.

switch switch switch switch I don't like this i'm going to switch.

It slowly slowed us down, do you feel as if there was more choice or less choice, though at the video store.

Then there is.

Martin McGreevy: One person yeah it's an interesting question because, certainly now, you can make the argument that like you can truly growing up Minister didn't watch anything anytime any moment, and so there's that that ability to like I subscribed to.

criterion channel, and you can watch any film in the collection, for the most part the click of a button like netflix.

But at the same time, because of the.

immediacy and speed I don't end up watching as much film, as I did when I was at Howard Hughes it's a weird paradox, but because I might be interested in any.

You know, on the garden youtuber who's teaching me how to cook or whatever the thing is now i'm not as likely to sit through a whole film and so in a funny way, even though the could say there was less.

choice at Howard Hughes or the video co op and then what what's available now I was more likely to watch the same the whole way through, because of that extra effort.

Monique Lillard: that's interesting you know a lot of us have sort of threaded.

If you wanted to watch and, of course, maybe there's an answer to this, that you know that I don't if you wanted to watch all the president's men.

you're right now Where would you go to do that, how would you do it, I mean, I know I used to go to the videos but.

Martin McGreevy: yeah exactly I mean now it's it's really true like now what i'll do is i'll go online and i'll say i'll cousins man and then it'll i'll say stream afterwards.

And then it will say.

Oh, you can walk you can rent it for $4 from Amazon prime or iTunes or netflix has it now and it just came into libraries.

And that's like really nice and handy and funding and you can watch them to move quickly and immediately that way.

But I also think that, like you're saying there was something kind of charming about going down to the video store and maybe that all the president's men is checked out so you get a different Robert redford film or you know what I mean.

By happy for it Oh, really, we could watch something you know something else in it that it led to that instead of like you, you kind of everything is so on demand and so so at your fingertips that you kind of like aren't surprised or you're not impeded, in a way that you were before.

Monique Lillard: That that's yeah.

that's interesting because I recently had something happened where something I was watching on netflix then they said it's over with it's leaving in two days I thought, no i'm not done.

So so anyway, I should I i'm looking at the time and I don't want to.

Martin McGreevy: Take.

Monique Lillard: Too much of your time this morning but.

What well, what do you think led to the demise of the video store.

Martin McGreevy: yeah I think truly I started to see it happening in first and music right where you saw music stores.

In the streaming era with Napster initially and privacy, but then iTunes and legitimate downloading and fall away.

or films were different, because the media itself was larger than a CD MP3, and so it took longer for people to download those things, and so it took more effort, and therefore it took people on the fence more time to figure out how to do it, so it was essentially.

More.

difficult to hire a thing or two for streaming companies put their act together, and so I think it was inevitable in some sense that with piracy and then also then with legitimate downloading.

brick and mortar stores in that regard within a struggle.

Because of the immediacy and what we were saying earlier, the convenience and I think it was sad to see that go the way that in film itself, it was sad to see film celluloid it go.

And everything turned in digital and everything you know, everybody at the camera phone make sandwiches both exciting, but also some of the beauty of only having a certain amount of film to shoot something.

Creating a particular way of working people working.

The immediacy heightened sense of of it like going away so yeah I feel like.

It went away just because of the convenience of.

Anybody being able to download anything they want whenever they want and then whether that's good or bad is a larger question.

Monique Lillard: that's what I was actually about to say, did we lose anything.

Do you miss it.

Apart from just nostalgia which i'm i'm completely for nostalgia, but do we have less now in any sense.

Martin McGreevy: I think definitely like it's shifted where communal curation is lost in that way where.

I would be so I was really sad to see it go and then I was thinking like man is something like the camera the next and.

Luckily, I feel like there's still a place, hopefully in a post world or a place, like the Kimberley to thrive and maybe even do better than normal because people still hunger, for you know experience, where everyone gets together in the dark and experiences.

light on a screen and together, but I hope.

You know hope it still has a future, I think.

It is sad to see place that at least in I was in school where people would gather in person.

From my generation and talk about so I mean I would see people talking to the you know Barber brothers about the newest Rakowski siblings films or the newest.

You know enemy like satoshi Cone zone that was incredible these things that you just I never would have heard about.

It in a pre Internet era, had it not been for them, and now in a posting in the air, I still think there's more power than ever in word of mouth have someone in your orbit i'm telling you what is impactful to them having a place to meet.

is also a lost art that sense, so I don't know it's a great question I feel like.

In the history of film it constantly evolving and changing really.

Film Community was based around so it opens your eyes through thing and see a little animation for like magically and then the early cinema as being you know about most random you know.

Strange things that they would Edison would film linear we may have brothers and everything and it just continued to evolve evolve evolve and now it feels like it's the next evolution.

But I do think what's lost is you know someone like putting tend to start at a video store and talking to other passionate associates who are basically kind of.

You know, sharing their but favorite films and their favorite.

You know obscure filmmakers that inspired them to make films and that generation of filmmakers.

is now shifting into anything and it doesn't necessarily mean it's bad at all, it just means that it's it's new we reinvented itself and now it's I would say, like that Community as founder found on different filmmaking youtubers who have you know their own video store essentially curation.

Monique Lillard: yeah you're right in 50 years they'll be doing a video Oh, the the golden era of.

netflix yeah.

But that brings me to.

If you have time just.

A question about your yourself so did the video store affect your life did it affect any of your life choices.

Martin McGreevy: Yes, definitely I remember one time, I went in there and I I got a film for.

It was pies what it was all done went in and I went to this film was like, and it was sundance hit people were talking about and.

Sure i'll check it out and I watched it that night and I became obsessed with it, it was about a mathematician it was shot in black and white white and it was this crazy film and.

That it was so cool and different use music so beautifully and watch the next film that filmmaker made a record for dream which I also became really obsessed with you know it was really intense and crazy film and.

And then I ended up like randomly when I moved to New York City in 2010 and landing an internship with that filmmaker.

and ended up working for Darren aronofsky on a couple of different projects and limited capacities as a young living kind of getting my feet in the industry would do things like I worked on his film black swan wrote a scoping.

Like which is kind of like this form of like that they would joke being like the front work in visual effects for the sequence in black swan the very beginning.

Through the sequence, and so, and then I would help an intern on different projects and I got to work with.

his team and get to know them see what you know kind of how the filmmaking sausage was made and and and I can draw a direct line back.

To seeing and renting this obscure film that had won sundance one year from Howard Hughes at the time to then having an interest work with that filmmaker.

Through all these different ways somehow fortunately getting that opportunity, and if it hadn't been for that I wouldn't I would not have even known about his work or or found him so yeah it was really definitely had an impact.

Monique Lillard: That is a while, did you ever say to him this all traces back to one it was probably a videotape.

Martin McGreevy: His best friend about it, who was my specific boss.

who worked with him and I told him I said, you know when I was in junior high I used to go to my video store and I found pie, and if i'm looking for dream and.

I became instantly obsessed with those two and then a couple of films and donnie darko is another one some other films from other filmmakers.

But those were hugely influential to me, and the reason why i'm here and they got a kick out of that because I think to them, you know they making these films and in brooklyn.

They were just as I learned like really passionate like anybody else and had this amazing talent and amazing group of a team that came together to make.

These films, and it was really inspiring to me particularly with time because they made that for $60,000 at the time, which was crazy and expensive at the time for me feature film.

Now it would be $6,000 to make that.

Because of the technology and, but I just told them like that was really influential for me to see them do that and to watch.

That process and they had a whole behind the scenes on the DVD, which is another lost art from that era of Rentals was behind the scenes footage I think.

there's some that now that is like maybe a little bit more even sometimes directors, will do or directors commentary but it's not as much a thing in the streaming era.

Because it's not as a precious of a kind of event to watch a film and so it's rare and rare and that was another one of my film schools going through how to use it i'd watch.

The behind the scenes of I or was it seems have done darko now just watch it, what is it like on a film set What are they doing, how are they doing it, what does it look like.

When they're blocking out shots with their actors and semi tog refer and what's the producer do all of that, with glean from watching behind the scenes.

Of those, films and now that's something you can find maybe on YouTube or something or different things, but it was a revelation for me to get access to that so then transitioning to actually seeing it in person up close and seeing the day to day of it.

was a direct result of that of demystifying it behind the scenes.

Monique Lillard: yeah i'm glad you mentioned that and I think I forgot to mention it, when I was interviewed myself I.

Always watch the behind the scenes, even if it's a dumb movie anything i'll watch it just it's it's interesting to me it's even what did they talk about you know, some of them it's all about themselves others it's about it's just fascinating it's just fascinating.

yeah you yourself are a filmmaker because I think you've made a movie that has my house is that right.

yeah yeah I think so maybe I don't know what House but anyway, it was.

But.

Martin McGreevy: that's the famous.

Monique Lillard: Yes, right it's a movie star.

I assume, then in some ways the experiences at mainly Howard Hughes video, but then then ultimately I assume Main Street video co op have affected you as a filmmaker a complete feature maker yourself yeah.

Martin McGreevy: yeah definitely absolutely I still there was a series of.

compilation series that I remember our keys at the time had, and it was actually it was it was actually the Co op.

And when they transitioned it was from phone pictures, it was three directors music videos and my friend Mike Wilson, and I and a few others watch these religiously and it was the.

spike jonze is one of the filmmakers.

Joe gondry and Chris kind of again it's like Jones then went on to make her.

Yes, station beach or not, which credible films Michel gondry with eternal sunshine of the spotless mind and other amazing films and.

I remember those particular like those three were, if not the most like right up there with requiem or donnie darko as far as like inspiration for making films and making art and those.

were directly found at third street video time and my friend Mike and I would literally mainline watch those trying to dissect what they were doing how they're making these videos so short films and things.

And that was a total inspiration jumping off point for us to think that we could even do it ourselves and Mike works in video in portland he worked for a company.

where he got his internship for this widening Kennedy who's one of the biggest ad agencies in the world they do like the Nike account and stuff.

He went through their program and now he does video work and write scripts into short films and things in portland and then.

I went and worked in New York and then came back and make short films and different pieces here, and that would not have been I would not be doing that, if it hadn't been for the access that.

gave me and then, in addition to that, with the micro and then my Professor Dennis professors denison john West.

are also hugely instrumental who are also huge video proponents and customers, there were professors teaching fellow and watching films from all over the world and i'll send him on.

That was a direct result and impact me wanting to go in to making it and do it.

A little.

Monique Lillard: interesting and we are interviewing Dennis West for the series of oral interview so it's actually bone newsome is my co interviewer You might remember him I know you'd recognize the space manager there and he's around this so yeah.

Martin McGreevy: This listen john were when they were right out of that same kind of I would say the Trinity of our to use the micro.

And then, then some job teaching film at the ui and the films that I still think about this day that they curated or they either have us bring in from Howard Hughes or from the rental.

And then watch them as a class where they've even bringing laser discs from like some.

Monique Lillard: yeah.

Martin McGreevy: i'm Dennis would be like one of the jury Members on kind of thing.

Jones French cinema class was mind blowing I remember watching she touched on a female filmmaker class and I saw like films in like about Iranian women's prisons that never was.

Just mind blowing.

yeah dogma films from this one thing also not here that, like blew my mind, they were huge part of that that scene, I think that was kind of like I was so lucky to have her lesson.

Monique Lillard: yeah that's a wonderful tribute to all three persons of that trinity yeah.

that's.

Monique Lillard: very nice to say.

Martin McGreevy: And that is.

hugely instrumental.

Monique Lillard: Yes, yes that's wonderful.

We had all aware of the behind the scenes changing it from private ownership to the to the cooperative ownership, did you track that as a customer or.

towns.

Martin McGreevy: Do you know what time.

Monique Lillard: yeah it was.

19 92,015 to 2019 roughly.

Martin McGreevy: On it yeah so I must have been like I might have been here I might have been still in New York, I think, are kind of transition back and forth at the time, so I was kind of vaguely aware, but not super aware of it yeah yeah.

Monique Lillard: Any funny memories happy memories special memories stand out, I mean you've mentioned certain films, which is absolutely marvelous any strange stories anything you'd like to share.

Martin McGreevy: All I remember is one funny story that was like someone someone had.

been working there for a while and she said that the strangest part I was asking you what it was like to work there, and she said, the strangest part was the time i'm having her professors or a professor come in and and rent movies from the adult.

Section.

Monique Lillard: I kind of.

Like.

Martin McGreevy: She said it was just like the strangest thing.

That he, like he would kind of follow through on it and then be that she would kind of like go to class next day and be like.

odd you know, and that was like a thing.

That I just remember like it was so you know now this era, some you never would encounter unless you were had some access to someone's web browsers.

You know the reason but yeah at the time it was like such a public thing you know, and so it was just a funny story, I remember thinking that like.

yeah and then one time, I remember.

My friends and I were really excited we were like.

You know, watch the Blair witch project.

And we went in there to rent it and we got the counter and we didn't realize it, but we weren't old enough to.

And we were bummed because we didn't think was already there's something that we couldn't rent it and we didn't even realize that was a thing, and like they had to stick to it now.

yeah.

Martin McGreevy: click a button and I accidentally watching me.

Right, but the time we were super bond, because we were old enough to rent the Blair witch project.

Monique Lillard: that's buddy can you give me a rough date for the Blair witch and rough date for your your friend the student who was also the worker.

Martin McGreevy: yeah that would have been 90s, probably like 9798 for better speaker than the guy and then my friend, the worker was probably in there during the.

Late late late 90s.

Monique Lillard: early 2000s okay yeah yeah ah, those are, that is, those are good stories.

That have not heard either oh that's very good that's right.

um anything else I should have asked anything else you'd like to say, and again we can have another interview, if you think of something.

yeah don't hesitate.

Martin McGreevy: um no I think that's everything I would just say that I, I really am grateful to Howard Hughes for existing and then, and then they transition to.

The new space like that that was a really it's really why I said yes to the interview because I really benefited from them existing at all and.

it's been I still I will always have like really fond memories of of them.

cruising the shelves and finding different obscure.

titles that I would never have found otherwise, especially in the era of pre Internet era.

And just so grateful for them to have been in my life.

Monique Lillard: that's very nice that's very that's very nice to hear.

And you know I appreciate that you.

have put a positive spin on the change as well it's.

it's just change it's good you know it's yeah.

yeah yeah.

So that's that's helpful.

Martin McGreevy: yeah it is it's I mean so waking phones, on one hand, the like I was mentioning earlier, the art form itself isn't such flux right now.

With people not even be able to go to theaters right now, and everything reason um, and so the distinction between the Prestige film or you know film that would have been video on demand is less last the difference between.

You know, films and TV is less than less less you know it used to be a big difference there actors never deigning to be in a TV series and now it's.

The style it just changes constantly and one of the things that's exciting about the change is the fact that the technology's gotten so expensive for anyone to go out.

Even with their phone and make something compelling and interesting enough for the world to see so that's really exciting The sad thing is the loss of the Community, of the.

kind of watering hole where you would all come together and talk about some so the trade off is sad and then the the benefit is great so it's it's a lot of things at once.

As it always will be, so I just hope that film as a medium continues and we're not all the more sequestered in the virtual reality headset I think that's where all become.

That you know the grandpa like day we had to realize that fancy you know your head and now you're yeah matrix thing like yeah I love, I think I always hope for you know experience.

Where we all sit in front of the modern cave painting and watch a film.

Monique Lillard: yeah.

You know i'm sorry back just remembered something I wanted to ask you.

And today i'm seeing all sorts of people your age and younger even, and so I want to ask all of you.

If you do things online, especially if you do things like netflix they're keeping track of everything you watched.

Right so they're keeping track with themselves presumably potentially anyway for advertisers for the government, if they were asked.

Does that bug you know I floated the question I know.

How I asked it but.

yeah does it bug you.

Martin McGreevy: I think it's a great question, I think.

One thing that is interesting to me about it is so netflix.

Is it doesn't necessarily bug me personally, but I could see it being more of an issue just on principle and the thing that i've noticed, just as a my own observations.

As far as what the netflix lesson is they have access to kind of Nielsen rating, if you will, that is absolutely never been possible.

Before and what i've seen them is what they initially began with as far as content, and I know that this is.

You know, changing is always in flux so it's not one thing or the other, and it won't be maybe in a couple years it will be different, but for right now they've seen that, like the kind of content that gets the most views is a very particular stream of teen drama.

And that is what they make.

bank on and what people watch and that's nothing against that, as a genre or anything, when I was that age, I remember that was watching my terrible shows the time, but now it's like Oh, because they see what you think they think you want, because what we're clicking on.

It maybe makes it harder for things they don't yet know that you want, you know things that maybe.

would have been interesting to find but because their algorithm tells them, they only get.

10,000 years instead of 10 million it'd be less likely to put money towards That being said, I know that netflix is still revolutionising.

The amount of filmmakers that can make things and get eyeballs on it and it's doing such amazing work so it's not really to disparage that.

But it is a interesting new world for them to navigate and I hope that they continue to support what they are and i've seen really interesting filmmakers there they're doing awesome work on that.

And I do think it is going to be like interesting to see them like you're saying navigating I have more issue, I was issue with netflix.

knowing what i'm watching and recommending things because I used to love their algorithm in the past, recommending different movies to rent back when it was still you know, DVD thing, and I would like to get things that I couldn't get anywhere else from them, but.

I can see how i'm yeah in the future it's it's an interesting question to think about.

I guess i'm more like.

more concerned about what like someone like Facebook would do next, I guess you know.

i'm not offering information, other than what i'm watching versus on Facebook, you could be data mining your photos and what.

yeah.

yeah.

Monique Lillard: yeah yeah.

Martin McGreevy: A lot less than.

10 seconds.

yeah.

Monique Lillard: Anything else that you want to say.

Martin McGreevy: No, I think that's that's it that's that's great it's great to.

Monique Lillard: chat with great yes, and if there's anybody else you think we should I should be speaking to just let me know.

Martin McGreevy: yeah definitely if you could get one of the Barber brothers.

Monique Lillard: Okay.

Martin McGreevy: I would love to hear their tails because they really I know one of them for sure work there.

And they would know others that would have great stories from having worked there.

Monique Lillard: Too okay i'll do my best to track them down then.

I think I can do it through Facebook, through their mom.

i'm Facebook friends with.

Martin McGreevy: yeah but.

Monique Lillard: You know, thank you so much for your time and your perspective is really interesting and i'm going to turn off the recording if you'll stay on for just a SEC okay all right all right very good see.