Pat Engle recounts memories at one of the shareholders when the Howard Hughes Video Store was sold in 2009. Engle came to Moscow in the late '80s and was a frequent user of Howard Hughes Video. Engle says the newer store location was much smaller than the previous location, and that store was a consideration constantly. When the store was selling, Engle really wanted the collection to be kept together. Engles explains that towards the end of the co-op video store, there wasn't any communication or real leadership on site. Engle was the one who hired Cody Moore, the lawyer.

Monique Lillard: Okay.

Monique Lillard: Now there we go, we are recording now very good.

Monique Lillard: So I am monique lillard I am interviewing people as part of an oral history.

Monique Lillard: project for the University of.

Monique Lillard: Idaho libraries regarding the video rent video rental store in Moscow Idaho today is.

: April 28 2021.

Monique Lillard: Man it's absolutely amazing time is going.

Monique Lillard: incredibly fast, yes it is yes, it is.

Monique Lillard: And I am here to interview pat angle.

Monique Lillard: pat Have you had a chance to sign the waiver.

Monique Lillard: The one, the one that you signed, yes, yes.

Monique Lillard: Yes, okay very good.

Monique Lillard: Can you state for the record, your name just to make sure I pronounced it right and just a very brief statement of your relationship with Howard Hughes video and Main Street video and Main Street video co-operative.

Patricia Engle: of my name is kind of angle and my specific involvement was with Paris Howard Hughes video was.

Patricia Engle: I was one of the landlords of the last landlord so.

Patricia Engle: You know before it was.

Monique Lillard: dissolved Okay, you know pat i'm going to stop this for a second that it's not coming through very well, I think, is your connection if you go down and hit the little thing that looks like a wi fi is it say it's happy enough, is that your usual wi fi is five g stand on the bottom ribbon.

Patricia Engle: Actually, let me pause the recording okay.

Monique Lillard: All right, okay we're back up again and just up, can you just restate what you said about your relationship with the store.

Patricia Engle: Okay um my name is pat angle and i'm was one of the last landlords of Howard Hughes video before it ended it's raining.

Monique Lillard: Very good, very good i'm going to take you through.

Monique Lillard: The store the store itself describing the store describing how you found out about it, how often you rented then talk about the various phases of your ownership of the store and then about the.

Monique Lillard: relationship, you had with the Co operative and then the ultimate demise of the store and what happened to the video so that's sort of the progression that these questions are going to take here so first just describing the store and talking about it.

: Well, I would.

Patricia Engle: I would like to back up a little bit and.

Monique Lillard: give some.

Patricia Engle: background information.

Patricia Engle: Perfect um and that it actually starts back in the 90s, when I was an art therapist in private practice and looking for some better office space.

Patricia Engle: So I contacted my friend Karen Lewis, who was a real estate agent at the time, and she found this great building at 520 South main the building was for sale and Neil my husband, who was a professor of law at the university and a colleague of view.

Patricia Engle: A Neil, and I couldn't afford to buy it by ourselves, so we went we made arrangements with another couple to buy the store or buy the building and.

Patricia Engle: at the last minute, they change their mind and decided they didn't want to do it so.

Patricia Engle: Karen had noted that.

Patricia Engle: Gary my writers, who I only knew through my yoga class had put in a low offer on the building and had been turned down and that he might be interested in.

Patricia Engle: partnering with us so we didn't know Gary very well um but we called him and Jerry Stewart whose partner at the time in Hawaii and asked them if they would be interested in joining us in buying the building.

Patricia Engle: He said yes over the phone no sign nothing signed or anything and that was the way Gary did business.

Patricia Engle: So when they came back from Hawaii we seal the deal, he Jerry Stewart who ran the yoga studio of there was also one of the partners.

Patricia Engle: Their relationship eventually ended and Gary bought out per share so the building was owned by Gary and Neil and me.

Patricia Engle: Gary was the one who we did a lot of work on the building.

Patricia Engle: The upstairs we're we're four separate apartments at that time they were being rented to.

Patricia Engle: students.

Patricia Engle: And we so we turn them all into.

Patricia Engle: Alternative healing spaces, so I had my art therapy studio we had a film in Christ studio acupuncture.

Patricia Engle: We called ourselves the alternative and the idea was to create something in downtown Moscow that was supportive of the Community and offered people reasonably rental rental spaces to do those sorts of things so we're just trying to create a Community.

Patricia Engle: Gary was responsible, mostly for finding the tenants, in the first floor.

Patricia Engle: Gary, as I mentioned to you before was the deal maker in town, he was the kind of guy that used to hang out at the breakfast club or can't remember the name of it before it was the breakfast club, but.

Monique Lillard: The nabi in maybe not Okay, so he would hang out there, he knew everybody in town, he was always looking for.

Patricia Engle: A deal he owned he or at least the Royal motor in.

Patricia Engle: Our first tenants I think on that first floor was laura's tea and treasures, she was a local woman who was trying to you know, create a.

Patricia Engle: restaurant tea shop.

Patricia Engle: that lasted a number of years I can't remember all the tenants that we had but.

Patricia Engle: The probably the the second longest serving tenant was the the tattoo parlor.

Patricia Engle: Gary found those of course and.

Patricia Engle: At the time.

Patricia Engle: They couldn't find any space in on Main Street in Moscow, the only place, I could find was in a back alley because I guess tattoos back in those days were not considered part of the culture or something um.

Patricia Engle: When they left.

Patricia Engle: It was Gary who found Howard Hughes video so we're now getting into Howard Hughes video he.

Patricia Engle: Howard Hughes Howard Hughes.

Patricia Engle: As you probably know, was a rather call for character in in Moscow, who had an appliance store and had started a video operation kind of as a sideline and it became very popular and.

Patricia Engle: Every long term resident of Moscow remembers five days five video has five high $5.

Patricia Engle: It was a very popular place continued to be popular once Howard sold the appliance store he sold the video business, I think, also the same time.

Patricia Engle: New owners kept the video store until it stopped to becoming as lucrative you know netflix with FLEX was coming in and it wasn't making the same amount of money as it.

Patricia Engle: once did.

Patricia Engle: that's when Gary entered and Gary the dealmaker.

Patricia Engle: Convinced are decided that we should buy the video store he convinced Neil and made to contribute money.

Patricia Engle: He taught.

Patricia Engle: Kelly more and deb Rentals into.

Patricia Engle: Basically, operating the store and.

Patricia Engle: been there in kind contribution for a couple of years, so yep go.

Monique Lillard: yeah okay I gotta stop you for just a second we're still having some skittering i'm going to pause the video, and I have a thought okay just.

Monique Lillard: hold on.

Monique Lillard: Okay, and we're back on.

Monique Lillard: So go ahead.

Patricia Engle: Yes, no a buying the business was all of gary's.

Patricia Engle: idea, he he convinced nailing me to contribute financially and convinced Devon Kelly, to be the kind of on site people, because at that time Gary was doing some traveling as well, and we were no longer living in Moscow.

Patricia Engle: So.

Patricia Engle: Kelly DAB.

Patricia Engle: Gary and and me, to some extent.

Patricia Engle: moved video store.

Patricia Engle: From a much larger space to a smaller space and we had to do a lot of reconfiguring and I think I mentioned to you before that.

Patricia Engle: Back in those days they were all all vc ours, you know, so it was it was a lot of lot of stuff to move into a small space, and I think back then, I mean there was still like 30,000 videos or BC ours so yeah.

Monique Lillard: Let me just ask you a couple questions before we get too far Howard Hughes, who ran the appliance store is no relation to the other Howard Hughes right.

Patricia Engle: No, no, no.

Monique Lillard: In California yeah.

Monique Lillard: But everybody heard of him, and so everybody always laughed about Howard Hughes yeah.

Monique Lillard: Right what year was this that you bought the store and then moved it over to Main Street.

Patricia Engle: I 2006 2007.

Monique Lillard: Somewhere in there right okay great great thanks.

Monique Lillard: All right, but.

Patricia Engle: that's my best guess okay.

Patricia Engle: Great.

Patricia Engle: All right, i'm not sure, but it was a time when netflix was just coming in and people were starting to rely on that.

Patricia Engle: Internet access was still pretty spotty and in Moscow and.

Patricia Engle: stuff for the first couple of years of operations, we it was.

Patricia Engle: We made we made little bit of money off of it.

Patricia Engle: gary's idea was that.

Patricia Engle: We would have the rent and we would be able to make money and in the end if if the business of did not survive, we could only sell the videos for whatever our investment was so that was the original thing and things went along really well for a while, but somewhere and.

Patricia Engle: I think Gary died in 2012 I think.

Patricia Engle: And after that he wasn't the kind of moving force behind the video store by that time.

Patricia Engle: deb and and Kelly, I think we're getting a little burned out because we really weren't making any money off the video store and.

Patricia Engle: It was able to pay the rent and but the video store was very popular you know with the with a number of people, and the reason it was so popular I think was because of the employees there they were all avid movie fans people could go in and and talk to them about oh what movies.

Patricia Engle: You know, would you recommend, and it was it was sort of an iconic part of downtown Moscow.

Patricia Engle: And my view always was not so much the interest in the video store personally, since we didn't live in town, but that said.

Patricia Engle: The Indians hoarding them town and downtown life, yes.

Monique Lillard: Could you repeat that last sentence again there's a lot of background noise is that a dog walking through maybe.

Monique Lillard: Okay.

Monique Lillard: Sorry just if you just repeat that last thing.

Monique Lillard: Why was why did, why was it so successful in Moscow, you were just saying something about the Community if you just repeat that that'd be great.

Patricia Engle: I think the reason why it was so successful was because of the Community hold on can you stop it first.

: Absolutely.

Monique Lillard: we're not quite there okay we're recording again and i'll just add pat is sitting in tucson Arizona and i'm sitting in Moscow Idaho, and so we can't be in the same room, even though I think we're both vaccinated probably but.

Monique Lillard: that's what's going on here that's no problem at all so we're recording go ahead finish your sentence third time on that sentence try again.

Patricia Engle: we're talking about why the video store was.

Patricia Engle: Was was popular and it was because the employees bow and Ben and a number of others were all.

Patricia Engle: avid video movie fans and customers could come in and talk to them about movies and recommend recommendations for various movies, and it was.

Patricia Engle: It was really a sort of an iconic part of downtown Moscow and that was always my goal for that building it was such a special building it was, I think, built in 19 1898 and.

Patricia Engle: has had a rich history and was just really part of of downtown and Howard Hughes video was you know was part of that whole kind of downtown vibe you know book people was across the street, it was.

Patricia Engle: And we wanted to support that.

Patricia Engle: But the video stores stopped making money.

Patricia Engle: And so we tried various things to I did a lot of research with other video stores that were having problems at that time and.

Patricia Engle: Our biggest problem, I think, was that we didn't have enough space to expand and do other things like have movie talks or to.

Patricia Engle: offer something else other than the videos and.

Patricia Engle: But we tried, a number of things and then, finally, probably in 2013 this was.

Patricia Engle: After Gary that already died.

Patricia Engle: I wrote a letter to the customers and said we we can't really sustain this any longer.

Patricia Engle: We need another business model, this is not working and.

Patricia Engle: What do you, what do you think and we got a number of responses from the community of people agreed to raising the rates.

Patricia Engle: And there were some people who were willing to serve you included.

Patricia Engle: serve on a steering committee.

Patricia Engle: To try to figure out how we can survive and how Howard Hughes could survive, and I should go back and say when we first bought the business, we were actually going to change the name to Main Street video and the Community was.

Patricia Engle: kind of adamant that we maintain the name Howard Hughes video, even though it was a different Howard Hughes.

Patricia Engle: than the one that was the movie connection but.

Patricia Engle: So we kept the Howard Hughes video name.

Patricia Engle: So anyways the result of that.

Patricia Engle: of that.

Patricia Engle: Note that I wrote we formed a steering committee and thanks to you for offering your House to for meetings to meet with those folks to talk about how we could.

Patricia Engle: Keep the video store and at that point and we didn't we didn't have videos anymore, we had DVDs we transfer it off over to DVDs.

Patricia Engle: So do you have any questions.

Monique Lillard: Okay yeah.

Patricia Engle: just keep going.

Monique Lillard: No, I think i'm going to jump in with a couple of questions just that I remember from the store on Main Street.

Monique Lillard: How about the decor the green paint the movie posters who who put that together and just certainly story behind that.

Patricia Engle: um we had a lot of enthusiasm, to begin with, I did the painting Gary and Kelly, did the building of the counter and the space for the videos and.

Patricia Engle: did all of that, and so it was sort of a group effort and we just.

Patricia Engle: moved I think they moved in one weekend all that stuff we had to have a storage locker to keep all the extra stuff and.

Patricia Engle: yeah.

Monique Lillard: yeah yeah this is going to be the most disjointed video I now have a cat who's walking on my China.

Monique Lillard: And then deposit and get the crap down.

Monique Lillard: Excuse me.

Monique Lillard: Alright, we are recording again make sure it is okay definitely is now okay go ahead, yes, no, this is great, I really appreciate how you're taking us in a linear fashion, through time so.

Monique Lillard: Go ahead you're right we met at my house and i'm going to be donating to the library, the Minutes that I kept from that it was called steering committee minutes and.

Monique Lillard: I know we thought about tons of things i'll also say on the record, you brought us pastries every time it was delicious so.

Monique Lillard: And I remember having gosh as many as 15 people in my living room and then I think it whittled down to groups around my dining room table and right in this very room, as a matter of fact, so.

Monique Lillard: Do you want to take it from there, how did How did we ultimately decided to go co operative in your memory and.

Monique Lillard: And how did that work out.

Patricia Engle: i'm not sure exactly how it all came about, but I was doing a lot of research about what we might do I, I felt like it was important to keep the collection together and that was really my.

Patricia Engle: purpose, I talked to a number of libraries, I talked to the university I talked to eastern Washington I they were very interested, they have a film school up there, but they only wanted some of the videos not all of them and.

Patricia Engle: So I wanted to figure out some way to keep it together and my my position always was if the Community wanted, and if they can pull it together, then I will support them in whatever way.

Patricia Engle: I could.

Patricia Engle: And the the Community as evidence by the Steering Committee said they wanted it and so through a whole series of a we talk about memberships we talked about splitting up the there were.

Patricia Engle: Three shares basically each worth $20,000 we talked about splitting up those shares and making people shareholders.

Patricia Engle: Nothing seem to get any traction until this idea of having a having a Co op and.

Patricia Engle: And a membership having people pay for it to become members and then having a Co op and of Melinda shaab, who was the director of the food co op was.

Patricia Engle: was very helpful and in helping.

Patricia Engle: I think there's some arrangement with co OPS, you can help each other, and so they were very helpful in providing.

Patricia Engle: Computer assistance and that sort of thing, and the idea was we can have enough memberships at $200 I think it was for a lifetime membership, and we can pay off the $60,000 that.

Patricia Engle: 20,000 to Devon Kelly and.

Patricia Engle: We had bought Gary share share out before he died so we had that invested.

Patricia Engle: So we're going to raise the $60,000 we're going to renovate the front of the store, so we would have more space.

Patricia Engle: Everything was looking good.

Patricia Engle: They incorporated into a Co op and the idea, I think, was that.

Patricia Engle: They were going to raise the $60,000.

Patricia Engle: For the membership and they began to do the hat and it didn't quite pan out so at the end, I think it was the like.

Patricia Engle: It was a year they had.

Patricia Engle: To pay off the money that they have so.

Patricia Engle: After a year, it was clear that that weren't going to be able to raise the money through memberships people were paying just annual memberships rather than the lifetime membership and.

Patricia Engle: So the next agreement was that they would pay.

Patricia Engle: 25 they would come up, they could come up with $25,000 20,000 to pay off Devon calloway who had been the kind of the workhorses for this whole thing and had carried it through.

Patricia Engle: And $5,000 to to me, with the proviso that.

Patricia Engle: day they pay $5,000 a year for the next three years, so, and then I forgave them the money that we had.

Patricia Engle: bought gary's share out with.

Patricia Engle: So that was the That was the agreement and that was the arrangement and um where do we go from here.

Monique Lillard: Okay, let me follow up with a few questions and.

Monique Lillard: Then we will move it on forward from there.

Monique Lillard: let's see i'll start with you mentioned how important it was to keep the collection together can you just talk a little bit about the collection and what seemed so special about it.

Patricia Engle: Well, there, there was the whole criterion collection and there were just a number of We actually had some videos that that were not able to have.

Patricia Engle: That weren't available on DVD that were that were priced there were a lot of DVDs that were no longer available of those who love the DVDs like you.

Patricia Engle: This really loved it.

Patricia Engle: You know they had all the background information on them, then things that you wouldn't get if you went to netflix or whatever, and I think the other thing that made the video store so.

Patricia Engle: So unique was you could go in and and look through all the videos and see what was there and make your selection that way, rather than having netflix or somebody choose for you what was available for you to see.

Patricia Engle: And, as I said, the the collection was over 30,000 videos and DVDs mostly.

Patricia Engle: So I thought it was it was a great archive you know of of on a video or DVDs you know, in the 90s and early 2000s.

Monique Lillard: yeah yeah no that's a great setup I also thought frankly.

Monique Lillard: The bad dumb forgettable movies that were purchased that were still owned in a way they're, the most important because.

Monique Lillard: nobody's going to go to great lengths to preserve those but who.

Monique Lillard: knows yeah who knows.

Monique Lillard: Right yeah.

: Right.

Monique Lillard: Second question is you mentioned depth and Kelly did a lot of the work of actual day to day managing can you just very briefly say what exactly they did I mean I know deb met one i'll let you not i'll let you said I won't put words in your mouth of it that.

Patricia Engle: deb did all the books for the for the video store, so all the payroll and the tax deductions and all of that.

Patricia Engle: Kelly initially was involved in the day to day management of the store.

Patricia Engle: But over time at sort of dropped out of here, he was a he was our person on the building, so we paid him a small stipend to.

Patricia Engle: Take care of the needs of the building, and that includes the video store when the lights went out, and you know that sort of thing.

Patricia Engle: Right there's been problems and.

Patricia Engle: Whatever yeah.

Patricia Engle: yeah but the man, I think the manager.

Patricia Engle: Of the store went to bone and Ben and.

Patricia Engle: The employees, after that, except for deb's involvement with doing all the bookkeeping and.

Monique Lillard: Making sure.

Patricia Engle: things run smoothly.

Monique Lillard: Right.

: Right, so the managers did.

Monique Lillard: Yes.

Monique Lillard: Yes, yes, no, it was it was huge.

Monique Lillard: It was yeah so it was the managers who did the hiring and firing of the workers, I so.

Patricia Engle: I think I don't know for sure.

Monique Lillard: But yeah and so thinking of those days, who would you say was the most important person at the video store either a name or a position.

Monique Lillard: It was running well.

Patricia Engle: before it was a Co op.

Monique Lillard: before it was a Co op right right.

Patricia Engle: Oh, I guess, I guess, it would be Bo mm hmm yeah.

Monique Lillard: Because boat and.

Patricia Engle: Because he loved movies.

Patricia Engle: And he was the one who bought the movies.

Patricia Engle: each month and.

Patricia Engle: kind of was the person that people went to if they had you know questions about what movie to see and and like that.

Patricia Engle: that's good, but again I you know I didn't have much contact with the day to day operation, so I you know.

Patricia Engle: hard for me to know.

Monique Lillard: Okay okay so we've gotten ourselves to the Co op.

: Right.

Monique Lillard: And we've gotten to your basically forgiving a lot of debt or yeah I can call it, money that was owed to you.

Patricia Engle: When when we when we forgave that part done it became clear that.

Patricia Engle: We couldn't do the renovation on the front of the building we didn't have the money to do that and um I had a fiduciary responsibility to gary's daughter, and I couldn't come up with the money to do that.

Monique Lillard: Can you just say a little bit more, when you say it fiduciary relationship with Gary starter what What do you mean by that exactly.

Patricia Engle: When Gary died his half of the building that we owned went to face his daughter, not the business, but just the building itself.

Patricia Engle: Okay, so I could make renovations to the building.

Patricia Engle: Without her you know, being part of that process.

Monique Lillard: Right right, but so through the time that you had forgiven these loans and everything the video store was paying rent at that point.

Patricia Engle: Right, it was.

Patricia Engle: Okay.

Monique Lillard: It was okay.

Patricia Engle: It was not making a profit for the investors, but it was able to pay the rent well until.

Patricia Engle: Last last year we had to cut the rent by I think 500 bucks.

Patricia Engle: A month to be able to manage and that I think that's when we then I wrote the letter.

Patricia Engle: That we just couldn't keep on going that way that we had to change.

Monique Lillard: Okay, but let's move on into that that so it rolls along I do remember that that sort of the title to the store changed from you and your consortium of private owners to the Co operative.

Monique Lillard: lot of us remember the party that we threw I think you could not attend, I want to say it was in January.

Monique Lillard: Oh, maybe it was 2018 maybe.

Monique Lillard: 17 it's I have that in my records, but.

Monique Lillard: Not in my head sorry.

Monique Lillard: 2018 probably.

Monique Lillard: And we are so pleased because we were then definitely the managers of the place, you know.

Monique Lillard: giving instructions to the human to work.

Patricia Engle: that's right there was a kind of that tricky period.

Monique Lillard: Before I.

Patricia Engle: Officially, the Co until I think the 25,000 was paid and.

Monique Lillard: Exactly yeah so they.

Patricia Engle: paid and it turned over to the Co op right.

Monique Lillard: Right, and that was you know, there was a lot of positive feeling and we were certainly paying rent and you were already I think generously.

Monique Lillard: Cutting the amount that that the Co operative Oh, do you.

Monique Lillard: Right, so let me just pause us there for a minute and then we'll get to the Saturday bit.

Monique Lillard: But just pausing there i'm interested about this idea of a cooperative.

Monique Lillard: You were a business person, among other things, but a business person having a dealing with a cooperative what were the pluses or minuses in dealing with a cooperative and a cooperative board.

Monique Lillard: If any.

Monique Lillard: If you want to comment on that.

Patricia Engle: uh well as long as things are going smoothly.

Patricia Engle: There were no issue you know.

Patricia Engle: The only thing they needed to do was to pay the rent and.

Patricia Engle: So, as long as they paid the rent I was fine with whatever they did, and those first months were great I think.

Patricia Engle: yeah things went well the.

Patricia Engle: The downside only came later when.

Patricia Engle: Things were not going so smoothly and they were having trouble paying the rent and I was not able to communicate with anyone.

Monique Lillard: Right that's interesting, you say that at the end because I wondered if there were communication issues.

Monique Lillard: All along if its inherent in cooperatives that you know, obviously they're all these technical owners equally obviously there's a board of directors.

Monique Lillard: or whatever the exact phrases there's a.

Monique Lillard: President or chairman who presumably could speak directly to you so until the problem started was did that go fairly well.

Patricia Engle: The communication we actually had had no communication.

Patricia Engle: Okay, there was no communication at.

Monique Lillard: All it was just pay the rent and yeah got it.

Monique Lillard: Okay yeah.

Monique Lillard: you're okay all right okay so let's move to the Saturday stuff so then problem started and what were those problems, and can you just just continue on with your story or whatever, whatever.

: You know.

Patricia Engle: The problems were that.

Patricia Engle: They stopped paying the rent they didn't stop paying the rent they would pay.

Patricia Engle: $500 here $500 there.

Patricia Engle: But never the full amount of the rent so.

Patricia Engle: that first the first year, the first January.

Patricia Engle: I did receive the second $5,000 that I was owed.

Patricia Engle: But it was it was very strange I got no communication, it was like $5,000 show me the account and it wasn't supposed to be in the account it was supposed to go to me but anyway.

Patricia Engle: So I really had no communication with the board at all and.

Patricia Engle: But one one the rent stopped coming in with regularity, then I tried to make contact, I came down to Moscow and met with I think Lauretta at that time and.

Patricia Engle: She told me that everything was fine that they were collecting money to I think that the membership money was supposed to be for paying off the outstanding loan.

Patricia Engle: and

Patricia Engle: She told me, everything was going smoothly and not to worry, but then, as the months went on, and things still didn't seem to be resolved at that time there was a new director of the co op and I came down and met with him.

Patricia Engle: And it was.

Patricia Engle: I don't know it was a pretty on satisfactory meeting.

Patricia Engle: And what I asked for at that time, and probably I guess it was that that was the first time I said let's make a plan you know I know that you're behind in your rent and.

Patricia Engle: I just need the board to get together and come up with a plan about how you're going to pay this back or what you're going to do, or are you going to move or you know let's figure out something to do because we can't sustain this.

Patricia Engle: And that's when I started getting no response at all.

Patricia Engle: And when I would write I would get a.

Patricia Engle: email back that our meeting next week and we'll come up with the plan then and.

Patricia Engle: I just got no no communication no plan.

Patricia Engle: I express my willingness to work out anything because I again I I was a strong believer in the Community, not necessarily the video store, but the Community and trying to support the Community.

Patricia Engle: But I heard nothing and so Finally I.

Patricia Engle: Looked at the lease I did I did me to send me copies of all the documentation, because I had never even gotten that from the very beginning.

Patricia Engle: So they sent me copies of the lease and the lease agreement and it said that within 60 days of you know, I have a letter I could they could be evicted so I wrote the letter, and I said.

Patricia Engle: you've got to leave.

Patricia Engle: it's just not it's just not working out so again, I heard nothing.

Patricia Engle: So that's when I finally contacted cody more and said I can't do this anymore, I need to sell the building.

Patricia Engle: But it was what I had been told was you can't sell this building, while the video store is still there and so.

Patricia Engle: Because of all the difficulties that I had I was convinced that it was time to sell the store I couldn't manage it long distance and we had to find a new home for the video store.

Patricia Engle: So that's when I contacted cody cody then and you're going to interview cody so you.

Patricia Engle: help me.

Patricia Engle: hear his side of the story, but he was very, very helpful.

Patricia Engle: Because.

Patricia Engle: Once again I couldn't get any any communication with the board, I mean I even called Andrea at one time and asked her to although she was no longer on the board if she could find out what was going on financially with the with the Co op and.

Patricia Engle: I never heard back from her, and I think it was because they somebody didn't want her talking to me here, so I don't know.

Monique Lillard: I don't know I don't know don't lose your train of thought, I just want to ask a couple of follow up questions.

Monique Lillard: And the first is really just.

Monique Lillard: I you know I haven't practiced as a lawyer, for a long time, but I think I my brain notices something here, you know when you're saying to them, we can't keep going without rent.

Monique Lillard: Right it's not just your own.

Monique Lillard: What would I call it pocket book here that needs to get rent it's that you were.

Monique Lillard: You did have a duty to gary's daughter.

Monique Lillard: right because she's supposed to share in that right.

Monique Lillard: So it becomes it becomes you have duties and feelings in several directions which unfortunately began to have a conflict so again I realized i'm kind of editorializing but I that's what i'm hearing you say is that correct that accurate.

Patricia Engle: Yes, I mean you know, I was the only one who was owed money from the video store business, but as far as the building, those of faith was entitled to half of whatever and so when they weren't paying rent Yes, they were not only harming me, it was also faith that was missing out on that.

Monique Lillard: Right and then also, you said you were told you couldn't sell the building with this non paying tenant by home where you told that.

Patricia Engle: I think I think Brenda as a real estate agent or or maybe Maybe it was coding.

Patricia Engle: It may have been code Okay, then um yeah you're gonna have to find a way and I think he agreed to write a letter an official letter I had already written a letter he said well let's give them another 30 days or something and.

Patricia Engle: He yeah he said it's going to be really difficult to sell a building with a non paying tenant and and nobody wants to be the bad guy to kick them out, you know find the building and kick them out.

Patricia Engle: So I had contacted.

Patricia Engle: A real estate agent Brenda.

Patricia Engle: um and I was very surprised when she said, oh i've got it i've got a buyer it was the same person who had been contacting us three or four years ago about an interest in buying the building.

Patricia Engle: So they jumped on the opportunity and initially they said, well, we will give the video store a month to get out and move on.

Patricia Engle: But I think cody and cody will talk to you about having the same problems with the Co op board and trying to get an answer from them about what they were going to do.

Patricia Engle: And then, all when all this happened right when covert was starting.

Patricia Engle: And that, when they.

Patricia Engle: The new owner of the building said I don't want to deal with the video store.

Patricia Engle: So we have this this April date and.

Patricia Engle: The video store needs and all the stuff needs to be out of there by the time we close so that's what made it so imperative to try to find a home for 30,000 videos and DVDs.

Patricia Engle: It became it was clear to me at that time that I wasn't going to get the money that was owed to me and or the last Brent and so.

Patricia Engle: We worked out some deal with with cody where I just signed that away.

Patricia Engle: and

Patricia Engle: Fortunately cody was on the board of the kenworthy and talk them into accepting all the.

Patricia Engle: All the DVDs, and so they that they were moved in the middle of the night and.

Patricia Engle: During during the early days of the lockdown and then.

Patricia Engle: We had to pay we yeah we had to pay several thousand dollars to move the rest of this stuff out because the Co op wasn't coming up and doing those things that they needed to do.

Monique Lillard: By the rest of the stuff you mean like the shelving and.

Patricia Engle: All the shelving and the racks and all of that there was no room for those in the kenworthy so.

Monique Lillard: And and just.

Monique Lillard: If you don't mind, just to be clear.

Monique Lillard: Neither you nor the Co op board or the Committee we face in either you or the Co op got money from the kenworthy for the video, so it wasn't like they.

Monique Lillard: bought them, it was.

Monique Lillard: That, I guess, did you, I think, did you view it that you personally donated those videos.

Monique Lillard: To the can.

Patricia Engle: At least know.

Patricia Engle: Who knows who own the videos they own made money you know.

Patricia Engle: Who I don't know I just gave up whatever whatever share I had in the videos just to be able to move them out.

Patricia Engle: No, no money changed hands as far as the kenworthy getting the videos.

Monique Lillard: that's what I thought, and there was no deal, I assume, with the kenworthy about it will give you these if you'll keep the collection together or nothing like that it was just can you take them.

Monique Lillard: Right okay I gotcha I gotcha um.

Monique Lillard: let's see here.

Monique Lillard: And then, what then where are we.

Monique Lillard: Then you were done.

Patricia Engle: And then we were we were done at least my part was done.

Patricia Engle: right we settled on the building and.

Patricia Engle: I had given up all rights to the to the videos and I was hoping I would get a little plaque or something.

Patricia Engle: yeah.

Patricia Engle: But uh yeah I don't know and I don't know what the legal ramifications were for the for the The co op but they made it clear that they weren't able to do anything.

Patricia Engle: And they had to leave, so I guess it's similar to you have an eviction.

Patricia Engle: put all the stuff on the street.

Patricia Engle: mm hmm.

: i'm.

Monique Lillard: Just running through one more time just I think you stated this, but if you could just stated again back when we were meeting at my house and.

Monique Lillard: We were talking about all sorts of things so either then or any other time, can you just run through everything that you.

Monique Lillard: thought about doing with those videos other than just keeping a video rental store going like libraries, you said you spoke to eastern Washington and I just want to make sure it gets on this tape of or this recording.

Patricia Engle: I visited this video stores that were still in business there's a big one in portland and there's also a big one here in tucson Arizona.

Patricia Engle: There was one in baltimore my original home.

Patricia Engle: That was going out of business and I met with them to talk about how they were going about that and.

Patricia Engle: They were selling videos out, they were.

Patricia Engle: You know the problem, the problems that I had with all of those were that.

Patricia Engle: The stores that were still successful, as I said before, had a much larger space and they were able to offer other things.

Patricia Engle: And they both said that's how they were able to maintain business by being able to offer food or something special that you couldn't just get within just a video store and the ones that were selling Oh, and I think we contacted.

Patricia Engle: Some nonprofits in New England.

Patricia Engle: That we're doing stuff I talked to libraries libraries didn't want them because they use a different system, so they would have to recoat all the DVDs and they said no, we don't want them.

Patricia Engle: The University of Idaho said no, they weren't interested at all and.

Patricia Engle: Eastern Washington was interested in some of the the DVDs but not all of them.

Patricia Engle: And then we had I Oh, and I contacted the University of Arizona here and they were interested, but they needed.

Patricia Engle: Some way to look through to see which ones they want it and there wasn't anything like that available the computer system and, as you know, from the video Sir was pretty antiquated and.

Patricia Engle: wasn't able to provide that kind of data, and I think they they they said i'll send us send us a list of all your videos and and you know we'll see which ones we want.

Patricia Engle: So.

Patricia Engle: Those were some of the things that we we looked at doing good.

Monique Lillard: yeah well and I think you spoke with Washington State University, or at the very least.

Monique Lillard: A library and from Washington state was actually on that steering committee because i'm i'm pretty sure they were.

Monique Lillard: Either know or we might cherry pick but yeah and just something you mentioned and i'll just make reference to this because other people have been interviewed for this oral history, including Lauretta Campbell who.

Monique Lillard: headed up the Co operative board, and I must say, put in a lot of sweat equity herself.

Monique Lillard: Not equity just sweat right.

Monique Lillard: She just did it and there was.

Monique Lillard: So much time spent, and I know when I was on the board so much time about there was a doss based computer and then.

Monique Lillard: We hired somebody to move it over to some other thing yeah luckily I think you were out of most of all just luckily for yourself and then, of course, that other person didn't do everything we.

Monique Lillard: thought that they would do Lauretta wound up in putting herself the names and the numbers of a whole lot of the titles just doing the work you know because it had to be.

Monique Lillard: done, but what often was lacking was a list of all the videos and by that I mean the video tapes and the DVDs the titles I think it's the word that all the titles.

Monique Lillard: Because people would have liked by that point after we got used to netflix or some people did late to netflix Out of loyalty myself but.

Monique Lillard: Most people were on netflix the inability to say, well, what is the video store have he's worth going downtown and then I think that's what you're saying you ran into with these libraries and other potential purchasers.

Monique Lillard: I also just remember, and you can jog my memory, we talked about selling ice cream and the.

Monique Lillard: Video rental we talked about coffee and the video we talked about having lectures from people like Professor Dennis west of the University of Idaho who lives right in town, who loves movies or other people my retract who loves movies, you know there's a former law.

Monique Lillard: Professor he could have come in and spoken.

Monique Lillard: But then, that was the space problem you know, so I just wanted detail for the purpose of this record just all the different avenues that we're we're we tried to file yeah.

Patricia Engle: yeah I did.

Patricia Engle: I did talk to the kenworthy I was thinking that.

Monique Lillard: We have nothing with with movies and.

Patricia Engle: and have used their space do a shared space thing and whatever and I met with the director than and I can't remember his name.

Patricia Engle: But he took it back to the board and they said no, they weren't interested in doing that.

Monique Lillard: yeah yeah.

Monique Lillard: I remember that and just again for the record, oh the kenworthy is a former movie theater and actually before that it had evolved ville stage back there and.

Monique Lillard: it's used for live theater and then they.

Monique Lillard: More and more over the course of this very time period we're talking about they show movies, I was calling movies for grownups because it's not the blockbusters it's thoughtful movies on Thursdays Fridays Saturdays and Sundays, but of course that's been stopped because of the pandemic.

Monique Lillard: Also, but that's been a very successful place for people to gather and watch movies.

Monique Lillard: So it seemed like a natural.

Monique Lillard: link up and the kenworthy I think I just said was maybe three or four doors up right on Main Street right there so it's.

Monique Lillard: easy to go from one place to the other, but they weren't a Jason, which is what the pity was you know if only we could have pushed through a door, but there were one or two businesses in the way so.

Patricia Engle: But they they weren't interested there was, it was a contingent in Moscow that was very supportive of the video store there was also a contingents that felt like videos or DVDs are so passe.

Patricia Engle: All the.

Patricia Engle: blockbusters and all those are closing and it's really foolish to invest and I think that's what stopped the the membership from from fruition and also a lot of reluctance on the part of the kenworthy and other places, to take this on like this is a dying business and.

Patricia Engle: it's not really going to sustain I we also talked about.

Patricia Engle: drop boxes over at wsu.

Patricia Engle: We I went out and talk to like stores in in.

Patricia Engle: pollutes to see if they wanted to take some of our videos and rent them out and do like a circulating thing like a library thing.

Patricia Engle: so that we could get some income that way, but just really couldn't find anybody who wanted to jump on that, and one thing that that you and I have mentioned a couple of times is that what.

Patricia Engle: was probably really needed was somebody who had that fire in their belly and had the the energy and the enthusiasm to move this forward, it may have been Gary but alas Gary was no longer around and.

Patricia Engle: So.

Monique Lillard: yeah yeah.

Monique Lillard: I asked you that, because you did so much, but I want to ask a different question is there anything you wish, you had done differently.

Patricia Engle: I did what I did when I could I tried to support the Community.

Patricia Engle: I you know I don't like the way it ended, but I really I really trying to help them in whatever way I could, and so no I did my good.

Monique Lillard: yeah yeah and for what it's worth I would say, most of the people i've interviewed feel the same way, you know Lauretta said, and I want to pass this on to you because you're part of this she said, you know.

Monique Lillard: We did everything we could we did our best, and the result is the Community had that store for between three and five years longer than it might have you know and COPD happened just as coven always does it's like this malevolent bouncing ball.

Patricia Engle: With those.

Monique Lillard: products and it just cleans itself in, and it was part of the coup de gras it wasn't the only it sounds as if things were already going downhill, but.

Monique Lillard: Right part of the coup de gras people couldn't communicate people were so startled that in the course of these interviews people are groping for their memories and I think it's partially the trauma of the pandemic that it just.

Monique Lillard: Maybe not so much stronger just this.

Monique Lillard: Sir reality, it seems as if you're dreaming this can't be.

Patricia Engle: You know at night and.

Monique Lillard: I think it affects our perception, to some degree, so those are just my thoughts are made of you.

Monique Lillard: get help but throw them in you know so.

Patricia Engle: yeah you know I think my my original position was if the Community wanted it will go and I think there were enough in the Community who didn't care or didn't want it to go.

Patricia Engle: yeah.

Patricia Engle: You know, and it was down to the hardcore and.

Monique Lillard: Right.

Patricia Engle: We did everything we could and.

Monique Lillard: Right right that.

Patricia Engle: wasn't being supported by the Community so.

Monique Lillard: yeah yeah and one thing after another came up to make.

Monique Lillard: Various ones of us have to step back you know, for reasons that didn't have to do with anything or anybody else you know it's it's the it's the way things go yeah yeah and I guess i'll just also add, you know buying in at $200 but shit lifetime membership for some people.

Monique Lillard: that's not very much money.

Monique Lillard: or they think.

Monique Lillard: To themselves that feels like a big check to right, but really if you're bright $50 four times you're already.

: been.

Monique Lillard: to other people.

Monique Lillard: In this Community they don't have those kinds of means I mean they're obviously a lot of students, there are a lot of people who work for Idaho minimum wage, you know, and that is just not enough so that's The other thing that I.

Monique Lillard: I find we run into a lot in Moscow is that.

Monique Lillard: A lot of people don't have a lot of wealth, but I put it that way, so yeah yeah.

: Right.

Monique Lillard: Okay.

Monique Lillard: cheerier a little bit.

Monique Lillard: happiest memory funniest story anything like that you'd like to.

Monique Lillard: Share here.

Patricia Engle: Oh.

Patricia Engle: I have no funny still free.

Monique Lillard: Okay.

Patricia Engle: i'm still i'm still i'm still in the post pandemic go slump or something yeah yeah.

Patricia Engle: My way out of it.

Patricia Engle: yeah I.

Patricia Engle: I didn't know it was it was fun when we started it despite our everyone's reservations, you know Gary was the the the video store was his legacy and I really wanted to keep it, you know as part of his legacy is another reason why I wanted to keep it going.

Patricia Engle: Good.

Monique Lillard: yeah yeah sounds to me as if you tried any reaction from his daughter, and do you think we should be speaking to his daughter about this, or was she.

Patricia Engle: Was she was not part of the video store.

Patricia Engle: I mean part of the.

Patricia Engle: Building Okay, and she.

Patricia Engle: You know, no.

Monique Lillard: Okay alrighty.

Monique Lillard: Anything else I should be asking anything else you want to say anything you want to add.

Patricia Engle: No, but thank you so much for redoing this and, despite our little glitches.

Monique Lillard: I hope we don't have to do it, a third time I hope not, but uh.

Monique Lillard: yeah and anything else that you think of adding we can have a shorter.

Patricia Engle: know it was really nice to be able to have that first conversation and sort of refresh my memory and and kind of get the timeline.

Patricia Engle: worked out and.

Patricia Engle: You know, for me the video store in the building were kind of part of the whole thing, and so, including that about the building and how special the building was.

Patricia Engle: Just kind of was important.

Patricia Engle: For me to to stress that.

Monique Lillard: Yes, yes yeah it was an extra nice building I went to some of those providers up there.

Monique Lillard: And it just had a nice feel you know it had opening windows and the sun streamed in through the windows and it felt What did you call it the alternative it felt both alternative and just healing.

Patricia Engle: It was a healer sector.

Monique Lillard: Really, so I know I don't have a tattoo I didn't get a tattoo.

: So.

Monique Lillard: we're still have to be careful what I say, but I was part of the rent the rent at one point.

Monique Lillard: That yeah right.

Monique Lillard: All right, I think I would have stopped the recording here and we'll sign off, but you know, thank you for your time, and thank you for your efforts to make this history clear.

Monique Lillard: And, not to mention I think i've said it several times thanks for all you did for the the keeping the video store alive, you know you really, really went beyond so okay now stop it now.

Monique Lillard: All right, hold on here we go okay you.